Discussion:
EVIDENCE OF DESIGN HENCE A DESIGNER
(too old to reply)
R. Dean
2018-03-13 04:58:05 UTC
Permalink
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation

is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved

in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair which is
designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations to correct the
errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.



Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because

the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to
explain.

By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.

No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means

and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
From article on DNA proofreading and repair:

"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can
occasionally occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base.
Uncorrected mistakes may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as
cancer. Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases
mistakes are not corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair
enzymes are themselves mutated or defective.



Mutations: In this interactive, you can “edit” a DNA strand and cause a
mutation. Take a look at the effects!



Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by
DNA polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In
proofreading, the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the
next one so a correction can be made.



The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly
with the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the
next nucleotide is added. If an incorrect base has been added, the
enzyme makes a cut at the phosphodiester bond and releases the incorrect
nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease action of DNA pol III.
Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one will be added
again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/




It seems clear that this is design.
Ted
2018-03-13 05:25:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair which is
designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations to correct the
errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can
occasionally occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base.
Uncorrected mistakes may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as
cancer. Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases
mistakes are not corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair
enzymes are themselves mutated or defective.
Mutations: In this interactive, you can “edit” a DNA strand and cause a
mutation. Take a look at the effects!
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In
proofreading, the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the
next one so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly
with the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next
nucleotide is added. If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme
makes a cut at the phosphodiester bond and releases the incorrect
nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease action of DNA pol III.
Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
Idiot.
R. Dean
2018-03-13 20:06:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair which is
designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations to correct the
errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can
occasionally occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base.
Uncorrected mistakes may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as
cancer. Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases
mistakes are not corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair
enzymes are themselves mutated or defective.
Mutations: In this interactive, you can “edit” a DNA strand and cause a
mutation. Take a look at the effects!
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In
proofreading, the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the
next one so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly
with the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next
nucleotide is added. If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme
makes a cut at the phosphodiester bond and releases the incorrect
nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease action of DNA pol III.
Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
Idiot.
You can't refute it, so you would kill the messenger.
Gospel TT
2018-03-13 21:05:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by R. Dean
Post by Ted
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair which is
designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations to
correct the
Post by R. Dean
Post by Ted
Post by R. Dean
errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is
difficult to explain.
Post by R. Dean
Post by Ted
Post by R. Dean
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can
occasionally occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base.
Uncorrected mistakes may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as
cancer. Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases
mistakes are not corrected, leading to mutations; in other
cases, repair
Post by R. Dean
Post by Ted
Post by R. Dean
enzymes are themselves mutated or defective.
Mutations: In this interactive, you can edit a DNA strand and
cause a
Post by R. Dean
Post by Ted
Post by R. Dean
mutation. Take a look at the effects!
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly
corrected by DNA
Post by R. Dean
Post by Ted
Post by R. Dean
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In
proofreading, the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before
adding the
Post by R. Dean
Post by Ted
Post by R. Dean
next one so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly
with the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next
nucleotide is added. If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme
makes a cut at the phosphodiester bond and releases the incorrect
nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease action of DNA pol III.
Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
Post by R. Dean
Post by Ted
Post by R. Dean
It seems clear that this is design.
Idiot.
You can't refute it, so you would kill the messenger.
Intelligent Design is blasphemy cause it put's the creation ahead of
the Creator.
Andrew
2018-03-13 03:58:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.

These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.

Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Post by R. Dean
which is designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations
to correct the errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Here it is simplified-->

Post by R. Dean
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
It is impossible to explain by any evolutionary pathway.
Post by R. Dean
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
It could not have.
Post by R. Dean
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
Because it is inexplicable by any 'naturalistic only' means.
Post by R. Dean
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can occasionally
occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base. Uncorrected mistakes
may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as cancer.
Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases mistakes are not
corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair enzymes are themselves
mutated or defective.
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In proofreading,
the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the next one
so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly with
the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next nucleotide is added.
If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme makes a cut at the phosphodiester
bond and releases the incorrect nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease
action of DNA pol III. Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one
will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
If this did not exist, we would have been -extinct- long ago.
Malte Runz
2018-03-13 12:40:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
But those mechanisms aren't working 100%. Well... in your case they
seem to prevent any new information to penetrate your mind.
Post by Andrew
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Again, we're not talking about a fool proofed system.
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
which is designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations
to correct the errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Here it is simplified--> http://youtu.be/HYS6EKnQcv0
Post by R. Dean
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
It is impossible to explain by any evolutionary pathway.
Right. When in doubt: goddidit!!!
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
It could not have.
Because you say so.
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
Because it is inexplicable by any 'naturalistic only' means.
Godditit!!!
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can occasionally
occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base. Uncorrected mistakes
may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as cancer.
Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases mistakes are not
corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair enzymes are themselves
mutated or defective.
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In proofreading,
the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the next one
so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly with
the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next nucleotide is added.
If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme makes a cut at the phosphodiester
bond and releases the incorrect nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease
action of DNA pol III. Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one
will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
If this did not exist, we would have been -extinct- long ago.
Godditit!!!
--
Malte Runz
Andrew
2018-03-13 12:28:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
But those mechanisms aren't working 100%. Well... in your case they
seem to prevent any new information to penetrate your mind.
Post by Andrew
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Again, we're not talking about a fool proofed system.
One of the early pioneers in DNA replication, Nobel prize winning
Authur Kornberg mentioned in his book "For the Love of Enzymes"
that the human DNA polymerase has an error rate of 10^7. Or one
mistake per 10,000,000 nucleotides. So yes, not "fool proof". But
only a fool could fail to appreciate it and see how it would prevent
evolution to occur per the Darwinian paradigm.
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
which is designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations
to correct the errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Here it is simplified--> http://youtu.be/HYS6EKnQcv0
Post by R. Dean
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
It is impossible to explain by any evolutionary pathway.
Right. When in doubt: goddidit!!!
Is that your studied conclusion?
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
It could not have.
Because you say so.
No, but please tell us how.
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
Because it is inexplicable by any 'naturalistic only' means.
Godditit!!!
OK.
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can occasionally
occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base. Uncorrected mistakes
may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as cancer.
Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases mistakes are not
corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair enzymes are themselves
mutated or defective.
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In proofreading,
the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the next one
so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly with
the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next nucleotide is added.
If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme makes a cut at the phosphodiester
bond and releases the incorrect nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease
action of DNA pol III. Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one
will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
If this did not exist, we would have been -extinct- long ago.
Godditit!!!
He is the Awesome One.

Glory to Him.

Amen.
Kevrob
2018-03-13 18:49:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew
He is the Awesome One.
So, he strikes fear into you....
Post by Andrew
Glory to Him.
...and you grovel.

Do you really claim to be an intelligent being with a will
of your own? Why worship something that is, at best, a bully?

Kevin R
Blue Ringed 8
2018-03-13 18:54:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
But those mechanisms aren't working 100%. Well... in your case they
seem to prevent any new information to penetrate your mind.
Post by Andrew
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Again, we're not talking about a fool proofed system.
One of the early pioneers in DNA replication, Nobel prize winning
Authur Kornberg mentioned in his book "For the Love of Enzymes"
that the human DNA polymerase has an error rate of 10^7. Or one
mistake per 10,000,000 nucleotides. So yes, not "fool proof". But
only a fool could fail to appreciate it and see how it would prevent
evolution to occur per the Darwinian paradigm.
Either he was wrong or else you got that wrong. Or whatever site
you copied from got it wrong -- I don't get the impression you
actually know a whole lot about all this yourself.

It's one mistake per 10^8 bases, or one tenth of the rate you said.
However, you also did not mention that the human genome contains
30 times that number of nucleotides -- 3.2 billion -- so that means
that there will be 30 copying errors every time a cell divides.

The repair mechanisms catch 99 percent of those errors, so the
overall rate of errors is about one in ten billion base pairs.

If we're going to talk science, then let's start out by geting the basic science right.

BR-8
Post by Andrew
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
which is designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations
to correct the errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Here it is simplified--> http://youtu.be/HYS6EKnQcv0
Post by R. Dean
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
It is impossible to explain by any evolutionary pathway.
Right. When in doubt: goddidit!!!
Is that your studied conclusion?
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
It could not have.
Because you say so.
No, but please tell us how.
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
Because it is inexplicable by any 'naturalistic only' means.
Godditit!!!
OK.
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can occasionally
occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base. Uncorrected mistakes
may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as cancer.
Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases mistakes are not
corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair enzymes are themselves
mutated or defective.
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In proofreading,
the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the next one
so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly with
the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next nucleotide is added.
If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme makes a cut at the phosphodiester
bond and releases the incorrect nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease
action of DNA pol III. Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one
will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
If this did not exist, we would have been -extinct- long ago.
Godditit!!!
He is the Awesome One.
Glory to Him.
Amen.
R. Dean
2018-03-13 20:39:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
But those mechanisms aren't working 100%. Well... in your case they
seem to prevent any new information to penetrate your mind.
Nothing works 100%, but you haven't explained exactly how or when or
why the mechanisms of proofreading and repair became into existence.
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Again, we're not talking about a fool proofed system.
It's better than no system. Which doesn't explain for how it arose
or why. Can you claim that mutations arose to repair mutations?
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
which is designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations
to correct the errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Here it is simplified--> http://youtu.be/HYS6EKnQcv0
Post by R. Dean
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
It is impossible to explain by any evolutionary pathway.
Right. When in doubt: goddidit!!!
This explains nothing to you, but you have _no_ explanation that's
naturalistic.
Post by Malte Runz
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
It could not have.
Because you say so.
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
Because it is inexplicable by any 'naturalistic only' means.
Godditit!!!
Where there is design a designer is inferred.
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can occasionally
occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base. Uncorrected mistakes
may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as cancer.
Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases mistakes are not
corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair enzymes are themselves
mutated or defective.
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In proofreading,
the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the next one
so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly with
the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next nucleotide is added.
If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme makes a cut at the phosphodiester
bond and releases the incorrect nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease
action of DNA pol III. Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one
will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
If this did not exist, we would have been -extinct- long ago.
Godditit!!!
At no time or not point have you offered an alternative other than it
was design by a designer.
j***@gmail.com
2018-03-13 17:36:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Since mutations occur, the corrective mechanism does not fully prevent mutations. Therefore natural selection and evolution are able to occur.
Gospel TT
2018-03-13 20:12:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by j***@gmail.com
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it
possible
Post by j***@gmail.com
Post by Andrew
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Since mutations occur, the corrective mechanism does not fully
prevent mutations. Therefore natural selection and evolution are
able to occur.

Andrew is a liar for Satan.
R. Dean
2018-03-13 20:44:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by j***@gmail.com
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Since mutations occur, the corrective mechanism does not fully prevent
mutations. Therefore natural selection and evolution are able to occur.
This does not explain exactly how or why random mutations can come
into existence to proofread and repair mutations.
Blue Ringed 8
2018-03-13 18:38:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Actually, it isn't.

The repair mechanisms are not perfect. Every child is born with 100-200
genes which differ from those same genes in each of its parents: mutations
which got by the repair process.

And somatic mutations continue to accumulate until we die -- in fact
the cause of death is frequently due to those mutations, copying errors
that the repair mechanisms failed to correct.

Presumably an intelligent designer would have made sure that the
repair mechanisms It created were not so fallible. In fact an omnipotent
intelligent designer would not have needed to create such mechanisms,
because Its chromosomal replication process would never ever fail in the first place.

BR-8
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
which is designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations
to correct the errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Here it is simplified--> http://youtu.be/HYS6EKnQcv0
Post by R. Dean
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
It is impossible to explain by any evolutionary pathway.
Post by R. Dean
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
It could not have.
Post by R. Dean
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
Because it is inexplicable by any 'naturalistic only' means.
Post by R. Dean
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can occasionally
occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base. Uncorrected mistakes
may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as cancer.
Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases mistakes are not
corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair enzymes are themselves
mutated or defective.
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In proofreading,
the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the next one
so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly with
the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next nucleotide is added.
If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme makes a cut at the phosphodiester
bond and releases the incorrect nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease
action of DNA pol III. Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one
will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
If this did not exist, we would have been -extinct- long ago.
Kevrob
2018-03-13 18:51:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Blue Ringed 8
Presumably an intelligent designer would have made sure that the
repair mechanisms It created were not so fallible. In fact an omnipotent
intelligent designer would not have needed to create such mechanisms,
because Its chromosomal replication process would never ever fail in the first place.
Could be "planned obsolescence." Old models break down, as designed?

It is shitty craft, but Detroit ate high on the hog doing that for
decades.

Kevin R
R. Dean
2018-03-13 21:17:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Blue Ringed 8
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Actually, it isn't.
The repair mechanisms are not perfect.
It's reasonable to assume they were perfect at the beginning of the DNA
code.

Every child is born with 100-200
Post by Blue Ringed 8
genes which differ from those same genes in each of its parents: mutations
which got by the repair process.
And somatic mutations continue to accumulate until we die -- in fact
the cause of death is frequently due to those mutations, copying errors
that the repair mechanisms failed to correct.
But it's not the somatic genes that's passed down to offspring, but
rather it's germ cells.
Post by Blue Ringed 8
Presumably an intelligent designer would have made sure that the
repair mechanisms It created were not so fallible.
Why?our bodies are not infallible. Decay happens: everything runs down,
we are programed to age and die due to telomere loss during reproduction
of cells. Telomeres become shorter every time a cell reproduces.
We human are born with about 49 "rungs" and we loose one with each
reproduction of a cell. Over time telomeres become too short to function
properly, resulting in
old age and death. Telomeres act like a clock aging in every cell of our
bodies.


Telomeres are shortened as we age, but telomeres can also be shortened
by stress, smoking, obesity, lack of exercise and a poor diet 3,4,6,7
Post by Blue Ringed 8
intelligent designer would not have needed to create such mechanisms,
because Its chromosomal replication process would never ever fail in the first place.
BR-8
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
which is designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations
to correct the errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Here it is simplified--> http://youtu.be/HYS6EKnQcv0
Post by R. Dean
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
It is impossible to explain by any evolutionary pathway.
Post by R. Dean
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
It could not have.
Post by R. Dean
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
Because it is inexplicable by any 'naturalistic only' means.
Post by R. Dean
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can occasionally
occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base. Uncorrected mistakes
may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as cancer.
Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases mistakes are not
corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair enzymes are themselves
mutated or defective.
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In proofreading,
the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the next one
so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly with
the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next nucleotide is added.
If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme makes a cut at the phosphodiester
bond and releases the incorrect nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease
action of DNA pol III. Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one
will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
If this did not exist, we would have been -extinct- long ago.
Blue Ringed 8
2018-03-13 21:59:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by R. Dean
Post by Blue Ringed 8
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Actually, it isn't.
The repair mechanisms are not perfect.
It's reasonable to assume they were perfect at the beginning of the DNA
code.
Um, why? Biology is a an exercise in "good enough". Good enough to survive
and pass on an organism's genes is the basis of it all. I'm not sure why you
assume "perfect at the beginning".
Post by R. Dean
Every child is born with 100-200
Post by Blue Ringed 8
genes which differ from those same genes in each of its parents: mutations
which got by the repair process.
And somatic mutations continue to accumulate until we die -- in fact
the cause of death is frequently due to those mutations, copying errors
that the repair mechanisms failed to correct.
But it's not the somatic genes that's passed down to offspring, but
rather it's germ cells.
Yes, but I also mentioned the rate of mutations in germ cells,
three paragraphs back. Further, the discussion is about
error correcting mechanisms, which are at work in both types of cells.
Post by R. Dean
Post by Blue Ringed 8
Presumably an intelligent designer would have made sure that the
repair mechanisms It created were not so fallible.
Why?our bodies are not infallible. Decay happens: everything runs down,
we are programed to age and die due to telomere loss during reproduction
of cells. Telomeres become shorter every time a cell reproduces.
We human are born with about 49 "rungs" and we loose one with each
reproduction of a cell. Over time telomeres become too short to function
properly, resulting in
old age and death. Telomeres act like a clock aging in every cell of our
bodies.
Which to me is quite the opposite of what an benevolent and omnipotent
designer would create.

I'm not saying you are wrong. Perhaps Brahma did design these marvelous
mechanisms. But I am saying that "We do not know yet" is not the equivalent
to ceding intelligent design. The history of science is one of shrinking the gaps
and reducing their number.


BR-8
Post by R. Dean
Telomeres are shortened as we age, but telomeres can also be shortened
by stress, smoking, obesity, lack of exercise and a poor diet 3,4,6,7
Post by Blue Ringed 8
intelligent designer would not have needed to create such mechanisms,
because Its chromosomal replication process would never ever fail in the first place.
BR-8
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
which is designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations
to correct the errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Here it is simplified--> http://youtu.be/HYS6EKnQcv0
Post by R. Dean
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
It is impossible to explain by any evolutionary pathway.
Post by R. Dean
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
It could not have.
Post by R. Dean
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
Because it is inexplicable by any 'naturalistic only' means.
Post by R. Dean
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can occasionally
occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base. Uncorrected mistakes
may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as cancer.
Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases mistakes are not
corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair enzymes are themselves
mutated or defective.
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In proofreading,
the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the next one
so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly with
the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next nucleotide is added.
If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme makes a cut at the phosphodiester
bond and releases the incorrect nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease
action of DNA pol III. Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one
will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
If this did not exist, we would have been -extinct- long ago.
R. Dean
2018-03-14 02:01:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Blue Ringed 8
Post by R. Dean
Post by Blue Ringed 8
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
It's an interesting fact, but evolutionist rarely talk about it in public
or on public forums. While Neo Darwinism claims that mutation
is a source of new information and natural selection becomes involved
in the evolution of organisms, there is proofreading and repair
There are proofreading and *repair mechanisms* that function
during the process of *DNA replication*.
These are molecular biological mechanisms that *prevent* neo-
Darwinian evolution to occur.
Here's the question that thinking people need to ask. Is it possible
for evolution to evolve a mechanism that prevents evolution to
occur? Because that is exactly what we have in the natural world.
Actually, it isn't.
The repair mechanisms are not perfect.
It's reasonable to assume they were perfect at the beginning of the DNA
code.
Um, why? Biology is a an exercise in "good enough". Good enough to survive
and pass on an organism's genes is the basis of it all. I'm not sure why you
assume "perfect at the beginning".
It's just an assumption and perhaps not a very good one.
Post by Blue Ringed 8
Post by R. Dean
Every child is born with 100-200
Post by Blue Ringed 8
genes which differ from those same genes in each of its parents: mutations
which got by the repair process.
And somatic mutations continue to accumulate until we die -- in fact
the cause of death is frequently due to those mutations, copying errors
that the repair mechanisms failed to correct.
But it's not the somatic genes that's passed down to offspring, but
rather it's germ cells.
Yes, but I also mentioned the rate of mutations in germ cells,
three paragraphs back. Further, the discussion is about
error correcting mechanisms, which are at work in both types of cells.
It's incredible but germ cell's telomeres do not shorten with age as
somatic cells do: which means middle aged people can have as a baby as
normal as the young. This would not be possible if germ cells were as
subject to decay as our somatic cells are.
Post by Blue Ringed 8
Post by R. Dean
Post by Blue Ringed 8
Presumably an intelligent designer would have made sure that the
repair mechanisms It created were not so fallible.
Why?our bodies are not infallible. Decay happens: everything runs down,
we are programed to age and die due to telomere loss during reproduction
of cells. Telomeres become shorter every time a cell reproduces.
We human are born with about 49 "rungs" and we loose one with each
reproduction of a cell. Over time telomeres become too short to function
properly, resulting in
old age and death. Telomeres act like a clock aging in every cell of our
bodies.
Which to me is quite the opposite of what an benevolent and omnipotent
designer would create.
It did with amebas for example: single cell don't age and die, they
reproduce by division where both mother and daughter cells continue. But
with higher organisms death is a necessity since the planet would become
over stocked in time as new births take up space.
Post by Blue Ringed 8
I'm not saying you are wrong. Perhaps Brahma did design these marvelous
mechanisms. But I am saying that "We do not know yet" is not the equivalent
to ceding intelligent design. The history of science is one of shrinking the gaps
and reducing their number.
You can call the designer by what ever nomenclature you choose, it
doesn't alter the possibility of it's existence or it's past involvement
with the universe and life.
Post by Blue Ringed 8
BR-8
Post by R. Dean
Telomeres are shortened as we age, but telomeres can also be shortened
by stress, smoking, obesity, lack of exercise and a poor diet 3,4,6,7
Post by Blue Ringed 8
intelligent designer would not have needed to create such mechanisms,
because Its chromosomal replication process would never ever fail in the first place.
BR-8
Post by Andrew
Post by R. Dean
which is designed to detect faulty new DNA and begin operations
to correct the errors by removing and replacing the faulty DNA.
Here it is simplified--> http://youtu.be/HYS6EKnQcv0
Post by R. Dean
Possibly the reason this topic is not so commonly discussed is because
the origin of this process of proofreading and repair is difficult to explain.
It is impossible to explain by any evolutionary pathway.
Post by R. Dean
By what procedure could mutation create the proofreading and repair.
It could not have.
Post by R. Dean
No one that I've read provides any details as to how, by what means
Because it is inexplicable by any 'naturalistic only' means.
Post by R. Dean
and what steps could this have come about.
To provide the standard
line of mutation and natural selection explains nothing where
error in copying occurs.
"DNA replication is a highly accurate process, but mistakes can occasionally
occur as when a DNA polymerase inserts a wrong base. Uncorrected mistakes
may sometimes lead to serious consequences, such as cancer.
Repair mechanisms can correct the mistakes, but in rare cases mistakes are not
corrected, leading to mutations; in other cases, repair enzymes are themselves
mutated or defective.
Most of the mistakes during DNA replication are promptly corrected by DNA
polymerase which proofreads the base that has just been added. In proofreading,
the DNA pol reads the newly-added base before adding the next one
so a correction can be made.
The polymerase checks whether the newly-added base has paired correctly with
the base in the template strand. If it is the correct base, the next nucleotide is added.
If an incorrect base has been added, the enzyme makes a cut at the phosphodiester
bond and releases the incorrect nucleotide. This is performed by the exonuclease
action of DNA pol III. Once the incorrect nucleotide has been removed, a new one
will be added again."
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-biology/chapter/dna-repair/
It seems clear that this is design.
If this did not exist, we would have been -extinct- long ago.
b***@m.nu
2018-03-13 23:12:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by R. Dean
It seems clear that this is design.
It also seems clear that you are a moron.
Lets just say there is a designer, then who/what designed the
designer. Who or what designed the designer that designed the
designer.....

I was not about to read all of that crap just the last line LOL. You
theists just don't ever ask the proper questions. Just a bunch of crap
that will make your lies see a bit less obvious.
R. Dean
2018-03-14 02:06:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@m.nu
Post by R. Dean
It seems clear that this is design.
It also seems clear that you are a moron.
This is a lie, but the truth is you are a bastard!
Post by b***@m.nu
Lets just say there is a designer, then who/what designed the
designer. Who or what designed the designer that designed the
designer.....
Never understood the term eternal, without beginning or end. There
are many people including Albert Einstein who believed this about the
universe.
Post by b***@m.nu
I was not about to read all of that crap just the last line LOL. You
theists just don't ever ask the proper questions. Just a bunch of crap
that will make your lies see a bit less obvious.
Then you cannot have an opinion beyond your extreme bias and closed mind..
Loading...