Discussion:
What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin
(too old to reply)
b***@gmail.com
2020-03-23 23:11:17 UTC
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What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin

Perhaps scientists fear that acceptance of this conclusion would open the door
to the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
by Dean H. Kenyon


<https://evolutionnews.org/2020/03/what-scientists-fear-foreword-to-the-mystery-of-lifes-origin/>
Harry Krishna
2020-03-24 11:25:17 UTC
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Post by b***@gmail.com
What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin
Perhaps scientists fear that acceptance of this conclusion would open the door
to the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
by Dean H. Kenyon
<https://evolutionnews.org/2020/03/what-scientists-fear-foreword-to-the-mystery-of-lifes-origin/>
Tell me, are there any non k00ksites you follow? Asking for a friend.
Christopher A. Lee
2020-03-24 14:46:17 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 24 Mar 2020 07:25:17 -0400, Harry Krishna
Did this loonie ever have a functioning mind?
Post by Harry Krishna
Post by b***@gmail.com
What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin
Perhaps scientists fear that acceptance of this conclusion would open the door
to the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
by Dean H. Kenyon
What a fucking moron. A deliberate, transparent lie by a religious
loonie whose obsession with atheists for all these years, shows he is
seriously mentally ill.
Post by Harry Krishna
Post by b***@gmail.com
<https://evolutionnews.org/2020/03/what-scientists-fear-foreword-to-the-mystery-of-lifes-origin/>
Tell me, are there any non k00ksites you follow? Asking for a friend.
The in-your-face, repeat liar knows perfectly well that the only
people who give it a thought are Christians, Jews and Muslims - and
that atheists aren't any of those so they don't even give it a
thought.

And that even if a scientist happens to be one of those, which becomes
less common the further up the ladder they are, they step aside from
their beliefs when they "do science".

Although I would be surprised if any theist even considered working in
an origins-related field.
JWS
2020-03-24 14:50:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@gmail.com
What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin
Perhaps scientists fear that acceptance of this conclusion would open the door
to the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
by Dean H. Kenyon
<https://evolutionnews.org/2020/03/what-scientists-fear-foreword-to-the-mystery-of-lifes-origin/>
Why does he not describe his experiments?
Davej
2020-03-24 15:18:33 UTC
Permalink
...the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
Heck, just show us a minor miracle: Grow a brain.
Christopher A. Lee
2020-03-24 16:06:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Davej
...the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
Heck, just show us a minor miracle: Grow a brain.
Impossibule.
John Locke
2020-03-24 15:43:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@gmail.com
What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin
Perhaps scientists fear that acceptance of this conclusion would open the door
to the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
by Dean H. Kenyon
<https://evolutionnews.org/2020/03/what-scientists-fear-foreword-to-the-mystery-of-lifes-origin/>
...hogwash...pure and simple. It's obvious that it's a natural world.
There's NO evidence whatsoever for an supernatural involvement. Thus,
we'll continue as we always have, looking for and eventually
discovering how life emerged on earth through totaly natural
processes. Real scientists do not even bother to contemplate
religiously infused pseudo-science nonsense.
Christopher A. Lee
2020-03-24 16:10:45 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 24 Mar 2020 08:43:57 -0700, John Locke
Post by John Locke
Post by b***@gmail.com
What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin
Perhaps scientists fear that acceptance of this conclusion would open the door
to the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
by Dean H. Kenyon
<https://evolutionnews.org/2020/03/what-scientists-fear-foreword-to-the-mystery-of-lifes-origin/>
...hogwash...pure and simple. It's obvious that it's a natural world.
There's NO evidence whatsoever for an supernatural involvement. Thus,
we'll continue as we always have, looking for and eventually
discovering how life emerged on earth through totaly natural
processes. Real scientists do not even bother to contemplate
religiously infused pseudo-science nonsense.
Unfortunately, they ignored it until it took hold in the third world
US heartland.
vallor
2020-03-24 23:57:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Locke
Post by b***@gmail.com
What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin
Perhaps scientists fear that acceptance of this conclusion would open
the door to the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin
of life.
by Dean H. Kenyon
<https://evolutionnews.org/2020/03/what-scientists-fear-foreword-to-the-
mystery-of-lifes-origin/>
Post by John Locke
...hogwash...pure and simple. It's obvious that it's a natural world.
There's NO evidence whatsoever for an supernatural involvement. Thus,
we'll continue as we always have, looking for and eventually discovering
how life emerged on earth through totaly natural processes. Real
scientists do not even bother to contemplate religiously infused
pseudo-science nonsense.
Well, hold on there for a second. Don't throw out the mysterious baby
with the bath water:

Consciousness seems like it has almost a supernatural component to it.
Not saying it actually does, but it can't be ruled out completely: really
seems pretty miraculous that we have a subjective life, and are self-aware.

I'd daresay there is a special order to the cosmos -- and from wherever
consciousness sprang, that is also where one would find "the Creator",
should one exist.

What do you think?
--
-v
"The Allwise Creator hath been dishonored by being made the author of
fable, and the human mind degraded by believing it." -Thomas Paine
LinuxGal
2020-03-25 00:21:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by vallor
Consciousness seems like it has almost a supernatural component to it.
Not saying it actually does, but it can't be ruled out completely
Supernatural components can be ruled out at once.
The instant a "supernatural" phenomenon is recorded
or observed it becomes a natural phenomenon. The
"super-" prefix immediately drops away and the set
of all natural phenomena is enlarged. This is why
we are told we must settle for ancient "eyewitness"
testimony of the resurrection rather than a living,
breathing Christ.
--
I have spoken.

https://twitter.com/LinuxGal
vallor
2020-03-25 00:29:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by vallor
Consciousness seems like it has almost a supernatural component to it.
Not saying it actually does, but it can't be ruled out completely
Supernatural components can be ruled out at once. The instant a
"supernatural" phenomenon is recorded or observed it becomes a natural
phenomenon.
Semantics.

Substitute "hereforto unknown natural processes" for "supernatural".
The "super-" prefix immediately drops away and the set of
all natural phenomena is enlarged. This is why we are told we must
settle for ancient "eyewitness"
testimony of the resurrection rather than a living,
breathing Christ.
Interesting example, but I don't subscribe to the idea that any Jesus was
resurrected except, perhaps, from a "swoon".

(Three hours on the cross isn't enough to kill a healthy individual...as
can be seen by devout Christians in the Philippines who have themselves
crucified every Easter.)
--
-v
"The Allwise Creator hath been dishonored by being made the author of
fable, and the human mind degraded by believing it." -Thomas Paine
Bob
2020-03-25 00:54:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by vallor
Post by vallor
Consciousness seems like it has almost a supernatural component to it.
Not saying it actually does, but it can't be ruled out completely
Supernatural components can be ruled out at once. The instant a
"supernatural" phenomenon is recorded or observed it becomes a natural
phenomenon.
Semantics.
Substitute "hereforto unknown natural processes" for "supernatural".
The "super-" prefix immediately drops away and the set of
all natural phenomena is enlarged. This is why we are told we must
settle for ancient "eyewitness"
testimony of the resurrection rather than a living,
breathing Christ.
Interesting example, but I don't subscribe to the idea that any Jesus was
resurrected except, perhaps, from a "swoon".
(Three hours on the cross isn't enough to kill a healthy individual...as
can be seen by devout Christians in the Philippines who have themselves
crucified every Easter.)
I think you're wrong.

https://www.allaboutjesuschrist.org/crucifixion.htm

Are they whipped and flogged with a flagrum before being crucified,
while wearing a crown of thorns that's digging into their scalps? And
then does somebody pierce their side with a spear, that could have
been used earlier that day to kill a pig?

Probably not. I know you're wrong.
vallor
2020-03-26 11:26:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob
Post by vallor
Post by vallor
Consciousness seems like it has almost a supernatural component to it.
Not saying it actually does, but it can't be ruled out completely
Supernatural components can be ruled out at once. The instant a
"supernatural" phenomenon is recorded or observed it becomes a natural
phenomenon.
Semantics.
Substitute "hereforto unknown natural processes" for "supernatural".
The "super-" prefix immediately drops away and the set of all natural
phenomena is enlarged. This is why we are told we must settle for
ancient "eyewitness"
testimony of the resurrection rather than a living,
breathing Christ.
Interesting example, but I don't subscribe to the idea that any Jesus
was resurrected except, perhaps, from a "swoon".
(Three hours on the cross isn't enough to kill a healthy
individual...as can be seen by devout Christians in the Philippines who
have themselves crucified every Easter.)
I think you're wrong.
That's nice.
Post by Bob
https://www.allaboutjesuschrist.org/crucifixion.htm
Are they whipped and flogged with a flagrum before being crucified,
while wearing a crown of thorns that's digging into their scalps? And
then does somebody pierce their side with a spear, that could have been
used earlier that day to kill a pig?
Had to have the spear. Otherwise, people might think he came-to.
Post by Bob
Probably not. I know you're wrong.
I'm not sure, but I think we've been down this road before.

So Jesus' side was pierced with the Spear of Destiny, and Joseph of
Aramathea caught the San Graal (holy blood) in a chalice.

Do I have this story correct? Or how much of it is history, and how much
fable, hmmm?
--
-v
"The Allwise Creator hath been dishonored by being made the author of
fable, and the human mind degraded by believing it." -Thomas Paine
Bob
2020-03-26 16:25:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by vallor
Post by Bob
Post by vallor
Post by vallor
Consciousness seems like it has almost a supernatural component to it.
Not saying it actually does, but it can't be ruled out completely
Supernatural components can be ruled out at once. The instant a
"supernatural" phenomenon is recorded or observed it becomes a natural
phenomenon.
Semantics.
Substitute "hereforto unknown natural processes" for "supernatural".
The "super-" prefix immediately drops away and the set of all natural
phenomena is enlarged. This is why we are told we must settle for
ancient "eyewitness"
testimony of the resurrection rather than a living,
breathing Christ.
Interesting example, but I don't subscribe to the idea that any Jesus
was resurrected except, perhaps, from a "swoon".
(Three hours on the cross isn't enough to kill a healthy
individual...as can be seen by devout Christians in the Philippines who
have themselves crucified every Easter.)
I think you're wrong.
That's nice.
Post by Bob
https://www.allaboutjesuschrist.org/crucifixion.htm
Are they whipped and flogged with a flagrum before being crucified,
while wearing a crown of thorns that's digging into their scalps? And
then does somebody pierce their side with a spear, that could have been
used earlier that day to kill a pig?
Had to have the spear. Otherwise, people might think he came-to.
Non sequitur red herring fallacy.
Post by vallor
Post by Bob
Probably not. I know you're wrong.
I'm not sure, but I think we've been down this road before.
So Jesus' side was pierced with the Spear of Destiny, and Joseph of
Aramathea caught the San Graal (holy blood) in a chalice.
Do I have this story correct? Or how much of it is history, and how much
fable, hmmm?
Another non sequitur red herring fallacy.


You're not very good at this, are you?
Christopher A. Lee
2020-03-25 01:06:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by vallor
Post by vallor
Consciousness seems like it has almost a supernatural component to it.
Not saying it actually does, but it can't be ruled out completely
Supernatural components can be ruled out at once. The instant a
"supernatural" phenomenon is recorded or observed it becomes a natural
phenomenon.
Semantics.
No.

Two points....

1. Nothing that was claimed to be supernatural, has ever turned out to
be.

2. If anything were to turn out actually to be supernatural, on
investigation, that would become part of the natural world and
technologies would be derived from it so (for example) we might be
flying on magic carpets instead of in 747s. We've seen this in some
science fiction "universes".
Post by vallor
Substitute "hereforto unknown natural processes" for "supernatural".
The "super-" prefix immediately drops away and the set of
all natural phenomena is enlarged. This is why we are told we must
settle for ancient "eyewitness"
Exactly.
Post by vallor
testimony of the resurrection rather than a living,
breathing Christ.
Interesting example, but I don't subscribe to the idea that any Jesus was
resurrected except, perhaps, from a "swoon".
If there were an historical Jesus as described by the Gospels.
Post by vallor
(Three hours on the cross isn't enough to kill a healthy individual...as
can be seen by devout Christians in the Philippines who have themselves
crucified every Easter.)
LinuxGal
2020-03-25 01:51:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by vallor
(Three hours on the cross isn't enough to kill a healthy individual...as
can be seen by devout Christians in the Philippines who have themselves
crucified every Easter.)
Now try it after having been beat more than half to death by
Romans with a thong braided with lead pellets and bone and brass.
--
I have spoken.

https://twitter.com/LinuxGal
----------- A t h e i s t ------------
2020-03-25 02:22:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by vallor
(Three hours on the cross isn't enough to kill a healthy individual...as
can be seen by devout Christians in the Philippines who have themselves
crucified every Easter.)
Now try it after having been beat more than half to death by Romans with
a thong braided with lead pellets and bone and brass.
As a god pretending to be human, doesn't mean a thing.
--
There is no verifiable evidence of any god(s). None whatsoever.
Christian: a person afraid of a perpetually hiding [imaginary] god.
Extortion (Believe or Burn) is _THE_ foundation of Christianity.
Bob
2020-03-25 00:35:25 UTC
Permalink
[W]e are told we must settle for ancient "eyewitness" testimony of the
resurrection rather than a living, breathing Christ.
Who exactly is telling you that?
LinuxGal
2020-03-25 02:08:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob
[W]e are told we must settle for ancient "eyewitness" testimony of the
resurrection rather than a living, breathing Christ.
Who exactly is telling you that?
Calvin, Institutes, V. xxvi:

...Why does not Christ rather place the illustrious trophies
of his victory in the midst of the temple and the forum? Why
does he not come forth, and in the presence of Pilate strike
terror? Why does he not show himself alive again to the
priests and all Jerusalem? Profane men will scarcely admit
that the witnesses whom he selects are well qualified. I
answer, that though at the commencement their infirmity was
contemptible, yet the whole was directed by the admirable
providence of God, so that partly from love to Christ and
religious zeal, partly from incredulity, those who were
lately overcome with fear now hurry to the sepulchre, not
only that they might be eye-witnesses of the fact, but that
they might hear angels announce what they actually saw...
--
I have spoken.

https://twitter.com/LinuxGal
Bob
2020-03-25 02:57:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob
[W]e are told we must settle for ancient "eyewitness" testimony of the
resurrection rather than a living, breathing Christ.
Who exactly is telling you that?
...Why does not Christ rather place the illustrious trophies of his
victory in the midst of the temple and the forum? Why does he not come
forth, and in the presence of Pilate strike terror? Why does he not show
himself alive again to the priests and all Jerusalem? Profane men will
scarcely admit that the witnesses whom he selects are well qualified. I
answer, that though at the commencement their infirmity was
contemptible, yet the whole was directed by the admirable providence of
God, so that partly from love to Christ and religious zeal, partly from
incredulity, those who were lately overcome with fear now hurry to the
sepulcher, not only that they might be eye-witnesses of the fact, but
that they might hear angels announce what they actually saw...
There was no "living, breathing Christ" on the earth when John Calvin
was alive, so he is not telling you, here in the 21st century, that you
"must settle for ancient 'eyewitness' testimony of the resurrection
rather than a living, breathing Christ." It's easy to see that he is
explaining why those with a "love to Christ and religious zeal", just
days after the Crucifixion, hurried to the sepulcher to eye-witness the
empty tomb, and perhaps hear what the angels had seen.

I believe you are misinterpreting what John Calvin wrote.
----------- A t h e i s t ------------
2020-03-25 03:09:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob
I believe you are misinterpreting
That common refrain from Christians is why you have thousands of
denominations/cults; your [imaginary] god is a failure at communicating.
--
There is no verifiable evidence of any god(s). None whatsoever.
Christian: a person afraid of a perpetually hiding [imaginary] god.
Extortion (Believe or Burn) is _THE_ foundation of Christianity.
vallor
2020-03-26 11:29:24 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 24 Mar 2020 20:09:46 -0700, ----------- A t h e i s t ------------
Post by ----------- A t h e i s t ------------
Post by Bob
I believe you are misinterpreting
That common refrain from Christians is why you have thousands of
denominations/cults; your [imaginary] god is a failure at communicating.
Bobbo forgot his usual refrain: "you couldn't possibly understand the
scripture, because you haven't been regenerated".

I'm sure he'll be back on track sooner rather than later.
--
-v
"The Allwise Creator hath been dishonored by being made the author of
fable, and the human mind degraded by believing it." -Thomas Paine
LinuxGal
2020-03-26 12:46:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by vallor
Bobbo forgot his usual refrain: "you couldn't possibly understand the
scripture, because you haven't been regenerated".
And you'll never make a move toward regeneration
until you understand the dire warnings in
scripture. Quite a catch-22.
--
I have spoken.

https://twitter.com/LinuxGal
Bob
2020-03-26 16:39:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by LinuxGal
And you'll never make a move toward regeneration
until you understand the dire warnings in
scripture. Quite a catch-22.
No one has ever made "a move toward regeneration".

That is something only God can do.

(If anyone reading this would like to ask me a question,
please email me at ***@gmail.com )
d***@cox.net
2020-03-26 14:32:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by LinuxGal
Post by vallor
Consciousness seems like it has almost a supernatural component to it.
Not saying it actually does, but it can't be ruled out completely
Supernatural components can be ruled out at once.
The instant a "supernatural" phenomenon is recorded
or observed it becomes a natural phenomenon. The
"super-" prefix immediately drops away and the set
of all natural phenomena is enlarged. This is why
we are told we must settle for ancient "eyewitness"
testimony of the resurrection rather than a living,
breathing Christ.
He taught us what to do before he ascended to the right hand of the Father. 2.2
billion people alive and well today don't have a problem with listening and
following. Why do you?.
the dukester, American-American
John Locke
2020-03-26 16:39:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by d***@cox.net
Post by LinuxGal
Post by vallor
Consciousness seems like it has almost a supernatural component to it.
Not saying it actually does, but it can't be ruled out completely
Supernatural components can be ruled out at once.
The instant a "supernatural" phenomenon is recorded
or observed it becomes a natural phenomenon. The
"super-" prefix immediately drops away and the set
of all natural phenomena is enlarged. This is why
we are told we must settle for ancient "eyewitness"
testimony of the resurrection rather than a living,
breathing Christ.
He taught us what to do before he ascended to the right hand of the Father. 2.2
billion people alive and well today don't have a problem with listening and
following. Why do you?.
...becuase, he has something that unfortunately you and 2.2 billion
gullible people don't have ... common sense ! Without it, you're
pretty much condemned to a life of blind faith.


______________________________________________________________________

"The hands that help are better far than
lips that pray" - Robert Green Ingersoll

"Nothing could be more idiotic and absurd
than the doctrine of the trinity" - Robert Green Ingersoll

"Fear paints pictures of ghosts and hangs them in the
gallery of ignorance" - Robert Green Ingersoll

default
2020-03-24 17:04:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@gmail.com
What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin
Perhaps scientists fear that acceptance of this conclusion would open the door
to the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
by Dean H. Kenyon
<https://evolutionnews.org/2020/03/what-scientists-fear-foreword-to-the-mystery-of-lifes-origin/>
Dean H. Kenyon is Professor Emeritus of Biology at San Francisco State
University, a young Earth creationist, and one of the drivers of the
intelligent design movement. He is the author of Biochemical
Predestination.


Or, in other words, NOT a scientist.
Syd M.
2020-03-24 20:29:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@gmail.com
What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin
Perhaps scientists fear that acceptance of this conclusion would open the door
to the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
by Dean H. Kenyon
<https://evolutionnews.org/2020/03/what-scientists-fear-foreword-to-the-mystery-of-lifes-origin/>
Only as soon as some actual EVIDENCE is presented.

PDW
Bob
2020-03-25 00:30:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Syd M.
Post by b***@gmail.com
What Scientists Fear: Foreword to The Mystery of Life's Origin
Perhaps scientists fear that acceptance of this conclusion would open the door
to the possibility (or the necessity) of a supernatural origin of life.
by Dean H. Kenyon
<https://evolutionnews.org/2020/03/what-scientists-fear-foreword-to-the-mystery-of-lifes-origin/>
Only as soon as some actual EVIDENCE is presented.
That's what the Intelligent Design scientists have been doing for the
last 36 years. But evidently those like you, who worship Scientism, are
blind to all that, and cannot see what ID scientists have accomplished,
and you would never think of admitting it if you did see it.

And, that's okay. You see, we don't need you. We can do it by ourselves.

One PhD at a time.

<smirk>
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