Discussion:
Every atheist fears death.
(too old to reply)
ravn
2020-02-04 22:05:43 UTC
Permalink
The mind is dependent on the body. The body exists in the world. So,
the source is the world, not the mind.
That is an illusion. The body is projected by the mind.
On what objective evidence do you base that on? Because you're apparently appealing to a doctrine, not anything based on reality. If you're appealing to doctrine, that has no explanatory force.
Michael Christ
2020-02-04 22:59:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by ravn
The mind is dependent on the body. The body exists in the world. So,
the source is the world, not the mind.
That is an illusion. The body is projected by the mind.
On what objective evidence do you base that on? Because you're apparently appealing to a doctrine, not anything based on reality. If you're appealing to doctrine, that has no explanatory force.
Ravn doctrine, aaa. :-).




Michael Christ
--
Rom 5:8  But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were
yet sinners, Christ died for us.

"If God is not first in everything He is not first in anything."
aaa
2020-02-05 14:34:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by ravn
The mind is dependent on the body. The body exists in the world. So,
the source is the world, not the mind.
That is an illusion. The body is projected by the mind.
On what objective evidence do you base that on? Because you're
apparently appealing to a doctrine, not anything based on reality. If
you're appealing to doctrine, that has no explanatory force.
Ravn doctrine, aaa.  :-).
Indeed.

This is how science has destroyed modern philosophy.
Michael Christ
--
God's spiritual evidence:

Truth, love, wisdom, compassion, knowledge, consciousness, intelligence,
happiness, faith, courage, justice, peace, freedom, and life itself.

God's spiritual evidence is evident in everyone.
Find it and treasure it because it's the covenant of God.
It's the reason why we are given this life on earth.
It's the foundation why we can have meaning in life.

Let's all honor our personal spiritual evidence of God for the sake of
Christ!
Michael Christ
2020-02-04 23:00:46 UTC
Permalink
The presence of noisemaker Ravn inept sinner snaky snippage, so the post
must be discarded.




Michael Christ
--
Rom 5:8  But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were
yet sinners, Christ died for us.

"If God is not first in everything He is not first in anything."
aaa
2020-02-04 23:06:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by ravn
The mind is dependent on the body. The body exists in the world.
So, the source is the world, not the mind.
That is an illusion. The body is projected by the mind.
On what objective evidence do you base that on? Because you're
apparently appealing to a doctrine, not anything based on reality. If
you're appealing to doctrine, that has no explanatory force.
That is a philosophical fact which is above and before science.

There is a modern mistake to search or demand physical evidence for
philosophy when philosophy is actually superior to all possible physical
evidence. It's putting the cart before the donkey.
--
God's spiritual evidence:

Truth, love, wisdom, compassion, knowledge, consciousness, intelligence,
happiness, faith, courage, justice, peace, freedom, and life itself.

God's spiritual evidence is evident in everyone.
Find it and treasure it because it's the covenant of God.
It's the reason why we are given this life on earth.
It's the foundation why we can have meaning in life.

Let's all honor our personal spiritual evidence of God for the sake of
Christ!
Cloud Hobbit
2020-02-04 23:27:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by aaa
There is a modern mistake to search or demand physical evidence for
philosophy when philosophy is actually superior to all possible physical
evidence. It's putting the cart before the donkey.

Only for you.
Nobody believes You.
Nobody agrees with you.
Nothing in reality supports you.

You re just a big nothing burger, with unicorn sauce.
aaa
2020-02-04 23:52:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by aaa
There is a modern mistake to search or demand physical evidence
for philosophy when philosophy is actually superior to all
possible physical evidence. It's putting the cart before the
donkey.
Only for you. Nobody believes You. Nobody agrees with you. Nothing
in reality supports you.
You re just a big nothing burger, with unicorn sauce.
Blind denial again.
--
God's spiritual evidence:

Truth, love, wisdom, compassion, knowledge, consciousness, intelligence,
happiness, faith, courage, justice, peace, freedom, and life itself.

God's spiritual evidence is evident in everyone.
Find it and treasure it because it's the covenant of God.
It's the reason why we are given this life on earth.
It's the foundation why we can have meaning in life.

Let's all honor our personal spiritual evidence of God for the sake of
Christ!
ravn
2020-02-06 21:03:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
The mind is dependent on the body. The body exists in the world.
So, the source is the world, not the mind.
That is an illusion. The body is projected by the mind.
On what objective evidence do you base that on? Because you're
apparently appealing to a doctrine, not anything based on reality. If
you're appealing to doctrine, that has no explanatory force.
That is a philosophical fact which is above and before science.
All species have to interact with the world sucessfully, in order to survive as a species. Science, in essence, is the study of the world. If humans hadn't figured out the world, to whatever extent that they could under the circumstances they found themselves in, they wouldn't have survived as a species. So, there is no before "science". Practical activities are unavoidable. Practice is going to lead to theories. Theories are going to lead to more practice. If your so-called philosophy doesn't have any concern over practical affairs, it's useless.
aaa
2020-02-07 15:12:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by ravn
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
The mind is dependent on the body. The body exists in the
world. So, the source is the world, not the mind.
That is an illusion. The body is projected by the mind.
On what objective evidence do you base that on? Because you're
apparently appealing to a doctrine, not anything based on
reality. If you're appealing to doctrine, that has no explanatory
force.
That is a philosophical fact which is above and before science.
All species have to interact with the world sucessfully, in order to
survive as a species. Science, in essence, is the study of the world.
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
Post by ravn
If humans hadn't figured out the world, to whatever extent that they
could under the circumstances they found themselves in, they wouldn't
have survived as a species. So, there is no before "science".
Philosophy is before science.
Post by ravn
Practical activities are unavoidable. Practice is going to lead to
theories. Theories are going to lead to more practice. If your
so-called philosophy doesn't have any concern over practical affairs,
it's useless.
That has nothing to do with what I said.
--
God's spiritual evidence:

Truth, love, wisdom, compassion, knowledge, consciousness, intelligence,
happiness, faith, courage, justice, peace, freedom, and life itself.

God's spiritual evidence is evident in everyone.
Find it and treasure it because it's the covenant of God.
It's the reason why we are given this life on earth.
It's the foundation why we can have meaning in life.

Let's all honor our personal spiritual evidence of God for the sake of
Christ!
Michael Christ
2020-02-07 22:40:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
The mind is dependent on the body. The body exists in the
world. So, the source is the world, not the mind.
That is an illusion. The body is projected by the mind.
On what objective evidence do you base that on? Because you're
apparently appealing to a doctrine, not anything based on
reality. If you're appealing to doctrine, that has no explanatory
force.
That is a philosophical fact which is above and before science.
All species have to interact with the world sucessfully, in order to
survive as a species. Science, in essence, is the study of the world.
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
Post by ravn
If humans hadn't figured out  the world, to whatever extent that they
could under the circumstances they found themselves in, they wouldn't
have survived as a species. So, there is no before "science".
Philosophy is before science.
Post by ravn
Practical activities are unavoidable. Practice is going to lead to
theories. Theories are going to lead to more practice. If your
so-called philosophy doesn't have any concern over practical affairs,
it's useless.
That has nothing to do with what I said.
Nothing gets in Ravn's way! :-).




Michael Christ
--
Rom 5:8  But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were
yet sinners, Christ died for us.

"If God is not first in everything He is not first in anything."
aaa
2020-02-08 15:12:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
The mind is dependent on the body. The body exists in the
world. So, the source is the world, not the mind.
That is an illusion. The body is projected by the mind.
On what objective evidence do you base that on? Because you're
apparently appealing to a doctrine, not anything based on
reality. If you're appealing to doctrine, that has no explanatory
force.
That is a philosophical fact which is above and before science.
All species have to interact with the world sucessfully, in order to
survive as a species. Science, in essence, is the study of the world.
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
Post by ravn
If humans hadn't figured out  the world, to whatever extent that they
could under the circumstances they found themselves in, they wouldn't
have survived as a species. So, there is no before "science".
Philosophy is before science.
Post by ravn
Practical activities are unavoidable. Practice is going to lead to
theories. Theories are going to lead to more practice. If your
so-called philosophy doesn't have any concern over practical affairs,
it's useless.
That has nothing to do with what I said.
Nothing gets in Ravn's way!  :-).
He is blinded by science and can't understand philosophy.
Michael Christ
--
God's spiritual evidence:

Truth, love, wisdom, compassion, knowledge, consciousness, intelligence,
happiness, faith, courage, justice, peace, freedom, and life itself.

God's spiritual evidence is evident in everyone.
Find it and treasure it because it's the covenant of God.
It's the reason why we are given this life on earth.
It's the foundation why we can have meaning in life.

Let's all honor our personal spiritual evidence of God for the sake of
Christ!
Michael Christ
2020-02-08 22:34:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by aaa
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
The mind is dependent on the body. The body exists in the
world. So, the source is the world, not the mind.
That is an illusion. The body is projected by the mind.
On what objective evidence do you base that on? Because you're
apparently appealing to a doctrine, not anything based on
reality. If you're appealing to doctrine, that has no explanatory
force.
That is a philosophical fact which is above and before science.
All species have to interact with the world sucessfully, in order to
survive as a species. Science, in essence, is the study of the world.
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
Post by ravn
If humans hadn't figured out  the world, to whatever extent that they
could under the circumstances they found themselves in, they wouldn't
have survived as a species. So, there is no before "science".
Philosophy is before science.
Post by ravn
Practical activities are unavoidable. Practice is going to lead to
theories. Theories are going to lead to more practice. If your
so-called philosophy doesn't have any concern over practical affairs,
it's useless.
That has nothing to do with what I said.
Nothing gets in Ravn's way!  :-).
He is blinded by science and can't understand philosophy.
He doesn't know what day it is because he doesn't trust the sound of his
own voice! He takes it out on us, of course.




Michael Christ
--
Rom 5:8  But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were
yet sinners, Christ died for us.

"If God is not first in everything He is not first in anything."
Michael Christ
2020-02-08 22:45:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by aaa
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
By the way, the Lord told me and showed me that. I was standing on the
top of a hilly range and looking down at all the trees and the ocean
beyond and I was thinking how beautiful it was and the Lord placed in me
the thought, 'Everything is dead'.

I said, how could this be Lord, not believing Him.

It wasn't until I happened to break off a small branch of a tree and
look at it in my hand as I walked back to my car that I understood what
He had told me.

You can't invest your hope in the things of this world, in anything of
this world, that is for sure. Is it any wonder then why the Lord, the
Saviour says, 'I am the way, the truth and the life??'




Michael Christ
--
Rom 5:8  But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were
yet sinners, Christ died for us.

"If God is not first in everything He is not first in anything."
Kevrob
2020-02-08 23:09:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael Christ
Post by aaa
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
By the way, the Lord told me and showed me that. I was standing on the
top of a hilly range and looking down at all the trees and the ocean
beyond and I was thinking how beautiful it was and the Lord placed in me
the thought, 'Everything is dead'.
In sane, rational people-speak:

"The thought occurred to McLoon: `Everything is dead.'"
Post by Michael Christ
I said, how could this be Lord, not believing Him.
TL:DR @ *

McLoon muttered a question to his ghod, thinking that
imaginary being had communicated with him.
Post by Michael Christ
It wasn't until I happened to break off a small branch of a tree and
look at it in my hand as I walked back to my car that I understood what
He had told me.
McLoon snapped a twig off a tree, killing that part of it.
If the branch was too large, he may have harmed the tree.
He then concocted some theological meaning out of his musings.
Post by Michael Christ
You can't invest your hope in the things of this world,
in anything of this world, that is for sure.
Placing one's hope in some non-existent alternate universe
doesn't make any sense.
Post by Michael Christ
Is it any wonder then why the Lord, the Saviour says,
More properly, "why the authors of ancient religious
texts put this saying in the mouth of their hero.."
Post by Michael Christ
'I am the way, > the truth and the life??'
It makes life easier for those incapable of finding meaning
in their own thoughts, actions and lives, to concentrate on
some imagined figure who stands in for the natural forces
the universe operates under - those who can't come to grips
with the idea that the universe doesn't have any as yet
discovered teleology?


* NcLoon is nuts. He thinks his ghod talks to him.

--
Kevin R
a.a #2310
Michael Christ
2020-02-09 01:53:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by Michael Christ
Post by aaa
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
By the way, the Lord told me and showed me that. I was standing on the
top of a hilly range and looking down at all the trees and the ocean
beyond and I was thinking how beautiful it was and the Lord placed in me
the thought, 'Everything is dead'.
"The thought occurred to McLoon: `Everything is dead.'"
Post by Michael Christ
I said, how could this be Lord, not believing Him.
McLoon muttered a question to his ghod, thinking that
imaginary being had communicated with him.
Post by Michael Christ
It wasn't until I happened to break off a small branch of a tree and
look at it in my hand as I walked back to my car that I understood what
He had told me.
McLoon snapped a twig off a tree, killing that part of it.
If the branch was too large, he may have harmed the tree.
He then concocted some theological meaning out of his musings.
Post by Michael Christ
You can't invest your hope in the things of this world,
in anything of this world, that is for sure.
Placing one's hope in some non-existent alternate universe
doesn't make any sense.
Post by Michael Christ
Is it any wonder then why the Lord, the Saviour says,
More properly, "why the authors of ancient religious
texts put this saying in the mouth of their hero.."
Post by Michael Christ
'I am the way, > the truth and the life??'
It makes life easier for those incapable of finding meaning
in their own thoughts, actions and lives, to concentrate on
some imagined figure who stands in for the natural forces
the universe operates under - those who can't come to grips
with the idea that the universe doesn't have any as yet
discovered teleology?
* NcLoon is nuts. He thinks his ghod talks to him.
--
Kevin R
a.a #2310
:-).

You can't pull down the truth, Gertrude, no matter how hard you try.

Everything is dead, just like the Lord said. Lasting life has been
severed from us just like the broken off tree branch and you are just
watching it pass into dust...like your life.

Don't bother having yourself cremated it is a waste of time, you won't
escape your Creator. We are more than just physical passing away
beings. We are spirit beings and all our cells have been replaced a
number of times and yet we remain, our personalities, our ways, our true
substance.

A reckoning is inevitable and a special reward for those who wipe their
ass on the truth.





Michael Christ
--
Rom 5:8  But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were
yet sinners, Christ died for us.

"If God is not first in everything He is not first in anything."
ravn
2020-02-08 00:32:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by aaa
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
You're missing the point. Science is the systematic study of the structure & behavior of what objectively exists. Is your study of god systematic, & objective, or not? If you claim idealism, wouldn't it be objective idealism or not? No, instead you're taking a space cadet approach to things. All you know is the mind. All that exists is the mind. But whose mind? Or minds? If you can't get passed just yours, then you've slipped into solipsism.
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
If humans hadn't figured out the world, to whatever extent that they
could under the circumstances they found themselves in, they wouldn't
have survived as a species. So, there is no before "science".
Philosophy is before science.
Science comes out of practical activity with the world. People speculated about things from the beginning. So, how can you justify your claim here?
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
Practical activities are unavoidable. Practice is going to lead to
theories. Theories are going to lead to more practice. If your
so-called philosophy doesn't have any concern over practical affairs,
it's useless.
That has nothing to do with what I said.
That's the problem. You divorced theory from practice. You want to say theory came first. But theories & speculations arise out of interactions with the world.
aaa
2020-02-08 15:11:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by ravn
Post by aaa
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
You're missing the point.
That's actually you. Life is not studied by science. This is a basic
fact you need to recognize.


Science is the systematic study of the
Post by ravn
structure & behavior of what objectively exists. Is your study of god
systematic, & objective, or not? If you claim idealism, wouldn't it
be objective idealism or not? No, instead you're taking a space
cadet approach to things. All you know is the mind. All that exists
is the mind. But whose mind? Or minds? If you can't get passed just
yours, then you've slipped into solipsism.
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
If humans hadn't figured out the world, to whatever extent that
they could under the circumstances they found themselves in, they
wouldn't have survived as a species. So, there is no before
"science".
Philosophy is before science.
Science comes out of practical activity with the world. People
speculated about things from the beginning. So, how can you justify
your claim here?
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
Practical activities are unavoidable. Practice is going to lead
to theories. Theories are going to lead to more practice. If
your so-called philosophy doesn't have any concern over practical
affairs, it's useless.
That has nothing to do with what I said.
That's the problem. You divorced theory from practice. You want to
say theory came first. But theories & speculations arise out of
interactions with the world.
That's your misunderstanding. I said philosophy is before science.
--
God's spiritual evidence:

Truth, love, wisdom, compassion, knowledge, consciousness, intelligence,
happiness, faith, courage, justice, peace, freedom, and life itself.

God's spiritual evidence is evident in everyone.
Find it and treasure it because it's the covenant of God.
It's the reason why we are given this life on earth.
It's the foundation why we can have meaning in life.

Let's all honor our personal spiritual evidence of God for the sake of
Christ!
Michael Christ
2020-02-08 22:50:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
Post by aaa
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
You're missing the point.
That's actually you. Life is not studied by science.
True. Science is studying what is dying and you can't know life by the
study of what is dying.
This is a basic
Post by aaa
fact you need to recognize.
True, he certainly does.






Michael Christ
Post by aaa
 Science is the systematic study of the
Post by ravn
structure & behavior of what objectively exists. Is your study of god
systematic, & objective,  or not? If you claim idealism, wouldn't it
be objective idealism or not?   No, instead you're taking a space
cadet approach to things. All you know is the mind. All that exists
is the mind. But whose mind? Or minds? If you can't get passed just
yours, then you've slipped into solipsism.
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
If humans hadn't figured out  the world, to whatever extent that
they could under the circumstances they found themselves in, they
wouldn't have survived as a species. So, there is no before
"science".
Philosophy is before science.
Science comes out of practical activity with the world. People
speculated about things from the beginning. So, how can you justify
your claim here?
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
Practical activities are unavoidable. Practice is going to lead
to theories. Theories are going to lead to more practice. If
your so-called philosophy doesn't have any concern over practical
affairs, it's useless.
That has nothing to do with what I said.
That's the problem. You divorced theory from practice. You want to
say theory came first. But theories & speculations arise out of
interactions with the world.
That's your misunderstanding. I said philosophy is before science.
--
Rom 5:8  But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were
yet sinners, Christ died for us.

"If God is not first in everything He is not first in anything."
aaa
2020-02-09 14:20:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
Post by aaa
Life is not of the world. The world that science studies is the lifeless.
You're missing the point.
That's actually you. Life is not studied by science.
True.  Science is studying what is dying and you can't know life by the
study of what is dying.
Yes. Evolution is evidence of the ignorance of the scientists.
This is a basic
Post by aaa
fact you need to recognize.
True, he certainly does.
Michael Christ
Post by aaa
  Science is the systematic study of the
Post by ravn
structure & behavior of what objectively exists. Is your study of god
systematic, & objective,  or not? If you claim idealism, wouldn't it
be objective idealism or not?   No, instead you're taking a space
cadet approach to things. All you know is the mind. All that exists
is the mind. But whose mind? Or minds? If you can't get passed just
yours, then you've slipped into solipsism.
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
If humans hadn't figured out  the world, to whatever extent that
they could under the circumstances they found themselves in, they
wouldn't have survived as a species. So, there is no before
"science".
Philosophy is before science.
Science comes out of practical activity with the world. People
speculated about things from the beginning. So, how can you justify
your claim here?
Post by aaa
Post by ravn
Practical activities are unavoidable. Practice is going to lead
to theories. Theories are going to lead to more practice. If
your so-called philosophy doesn't have any concern over practical
affairs, it's useless.
That has nothing to do with what I said.
That's the problem. You divorced theory from practice. You want to
say theory came first. But theories & speculations arise out of
interactions with the world.
That's your misunderstanding. I said philosophy is before science.
--
God's spiritual evidence:

Truth, love, wisdom, compassion, knowledge, consciousness, intelligence,
happiness, faith, courage, justice, peace, freedom, and life itself.

God's spiritual evidence is evident in everyone.
Find it and treasure it because it's the covenant of God.
It's the reason why we are given this life on earth.
It's the foundation why we can have meaning in life.

Let's all honor our personal spiritual evidence of God for the sake of
Christ!
Ted
2020-02-05 07:47:36 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 4 Feb 2020 15:42:27 +1100, Michael Christ
news:r1a1ni$7qs
What exactly can't I see?
Facts. Reality. Common sense.
:-).
The stock standard atheist 'air' answer! :-).
It's better than the standard "You just
have to have faith" Christian answer.......
You have to have faith in something, that is the way we were
created. I
have faith in a Creator God who purposely created with the laws of
life
everything we know and you have faith in 'everything just made
itself'
over a long wong wong wong time.
So where are your 'facts, reality and common sense??'
Here is mine...no thing, nothing can create itself. Got that??
Now, God is eternal or nothing would be here. Get the connection??
Now, you...
Michael Christ
God eats shit.
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